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Thread: Thai Aspirations

  1. #21
    Uber Star Soi wanderer Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน MarcTwoSix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chob View Post
    While I understand the subject at hand Cip , I would like to suggest that you two are not experiencing anything greatly different from what most 'newly-wed with a baby' couples go through - and thats the difficulties experienced with time allocations ( ie " Why am I working so much when alls I want to do is be with my young family ?" ) and money pressures ( "Why cant my partner see that we need to spend money NOW on X, Y, Z ) and the collision of the two ( "Whose gonna take care of bubs while we make more money ?" ).

    Your lovely wife is at least altruistic ... how many men arrive home just like you do , only to find that his wife hasnt even asked, isnt even willing to discuss it , and she has decided to spoil herself with a thousand dollar phone or bracelet ??

    I havent missed the point , but I just think its worth mentioning that one partners frivolties , or "great" idea , nearly always leaves the other partner with less of their 'hard earned' in savings and consequently annoyed ( and committed to even more work/time away !) , and this is probably the greatest cause of friction of all in any new marriage.

    Its really a matter of setting , if you can , SHARED financial goals.
    So coming to a rock solid agreement together on how much money there is coming in , and what money is going to go out and on what expenditures ... and sticking to it. If she understands the tightness of the budget , her expectations on what "should" be sent may change...
    Will she really delay getting her own house , and if so ( for Thai ladies often its so ) will she happily deprive you of a home in order to spoil her folks ?
    Or what about the money allocated for trips back to LOS? Would she forgo visiting her parents?

    As you suspect , and my experience in one relationship. was that sending Mumma lots of money only made her worse.
    A tgf of mine had a Mum who was a dreadful gambler - she pawned and gambled 2 scooters and a new pick-up my tg had sent her , and she had then started on selling bits of family land. I was rather shocked at the amounts and at how selfish someone could be , and when we went up to visit ( the tg hadnt been up for a year ) the very night before we arrived she lost 10,000 'on tick' , so the first thing we had to do on arrival was go and have a fight with a lone shark !
    Anyway , Pappa eventually threw Mum out . And she moved to Khon Kien and got a cleaning job and actually stopped gambling . I guess that was a matter of no money , and no more gifts from my tgf , and no cronies who'd lend her money ..

    So the message is obviously that giving money often doesnt help , and can just make some people worse.

    Some respondents here have also mentioned work for the missus.
    Im going to sound pretty awful in saying that that is not a solution I would entertain either .
    If I understand correctly , you work off-shore , and as such your baby only has one parent as caregiver a lot of the time.
    For her to turn around and start to use a sitter , wherein your baby has neither parent present , in order for the missus to earn money to send to a drunk , is not something I would see as acceptable.
    Sure , as a few have said , part time and to the tune of something like $200 a month , maybe.

    But now you mention the car ....
    Regardless if my wife was a local girl or an immigrant(like us to Canada) I would encourage them to work a bit even if the money is a net-net
    It just gets them out of the house and "baby life"
    And doubly so if they are adjusting to a new country

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcTwoSix View Post
    Regardless if my wife was a local girl or an immigrant(like us to Canada) I would encourage them to work a bit even if the money is a net-net
    It just gets them out of the house and "baby life"
    And doubly so if they are adjusting to a new country
    I would agree. When you get away from the home you meet other people and start to socialize. The extra income is only secondary. There are day cares for children but not necessarily for babies. I remember when my daughter was just a baby and my wife suddenly found herself at home instead of her part time nursing career. She suddenly felt stuck and could only socialize with one neighbour who also had a baby. All of a sudden it wasn't so great any more when I went out of town for a month at a time. Prior to that she had a social life, a part time job, and could go anywhere in my car.

  3. #23
    Uber Star Soi wanderer Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน Chob's Avatar
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    I dont agree.
    The baby is too young yet.

  4. #24
    Uber Star Soi wanderer Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน MarcTwoSix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chob View Post
    I dont agree.
    The baby is too young yet.
    I am not saying go to work in the 1st year or so of the baby's life(although if you have a good caregiver.........a few days a week wouldn't harm them)
    But, by far...............most of the more successful relationships I know, of any ethnic backgrounds........the wife works at least part time

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chob View Post
    I dont agree.
    The baby is too young yet.
    I understand what you are saying. I agree that new born babies are too young to be passed off, but once children can start walking around it does them a world of good when they are placed in a well operated day care. At one time I thought all babies should be raised by their parents, but I no longer believe that is in their best interests. Well run day cares are far more instructional than a bored mother sitting at home watching TV or playing on Facebook all day.

  6. #26
    ประเทศไทยเพื่อน Founding Member Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน jontymate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chob View Post
    While I understand the subject at hand Cip , I would like to suggest that you two are not experiencing anything greatly different from what most 'newly-wed with a baby' couples go through - and thats the difficulties experienced with time allocations ( ie " Why am I working so much when alls I want to do is be with my young family ?" ) and money pressures ( "Why cant my partner see that we need to spend money NOW on X, Y, Z ) and the collision of the two ( "Whose gonna take care of bubs while we make more money ?" ).

    Your lovely wife is at least altruistic ... how many men arrive home just like you do , only to find that his wife hasnt even asked, isnt even willing to discuss it , and she has decided to spoil herself with a thousand dollar phone or bracelet ??

    I havent missed the point , but I just think its worth mentioning that one partners frivolties , or "great" idea , nearly always leaves the other partner with less of their 'hard earned' in savings and consequently annoyed ( and committed to even more work/time away !) , and this is probably the greatest cause of friction of all in any new marriage.

    Its really a matter of setting , if you can , SHARED financial goals.
    So coming to a rock solid agreement together on how much money there is coming in , and what money is going to go out and on what expenditures ... and sticking to it. If she understands the tightness of the budget , her expectations on what "should" be sent may change...
    Will she really delay getting her own house , and if so ( for Thai ladies often its so ) will she happily deprive you of a home in order to spoil her folks ?
    Or what about the money allocated for trips back to LOS? Would she forgo visiting her parents?

    As you suspect , and my experience in one relationship. was that sending Mumma lots of money only made her worse.
    A tgf of mine had a Mum who was a dreadful gambler - she pawned and gambled 2 scooters and a new pick-up my tg had sent her , and she had then started on selling bits of family land. I was rather shocked at the amounts and at how selfish someone could be , and when we went up to visit ( the tg hadnt been up for a year ) the very night before we arrived she lost 10,000 'on tick' , so the first thing we had to do on arrival was go and have a fight with a lone shark !
    Anyway , Pappa eventually threw Mum out . And she moved to Khon Kien and got a cleaning job and actually stopped gambling . I guess that was a matter of no money , and no more gifts from my tgf , and no cronies who'd lend her money ..

    So the message is obviously that giving money often doesnt help , and can just make some people worse.

    Some respondents here have also mentioned work for the missus.
    Im going to sound pretty awful in saying that that is not a solution I would entertain either .
    If I understand correctly , you work off-shore , and as such your baby only has one parent as caregiver a lot of the time.
    For her to turn around and start to use a sitter , wherein your baby has neither parent present , in order for the missus to earn money to send to a drunk , is not something I would see as acceptable.
    Sure , as a few have said , part time and to the tune of something like $200 a month , maybe.

    But now you mention the car ....
    Good post Chob.... As with all. To navigate the blending of families is dynamic and each is different. No mater the race. It is a mixture of people. It can be from a vast difference of race, upbringing and social strata. Each is a new navigation chart to avoid sinking and to add.... for many uncharted waters.


    Cippy I will say that what you are experiencing, is not new. How to get through that is up to to you 'both' as a unit. If your care to drop me a PM I will share what we have done.... that may not be applicable to all you..... are experiencing but there will be points you may draw from and build on.
    "Man cannot discover New Oceans unless he has the courage to lose sight of the shore" 
      
       
       
         
       
      
     

  7. #27
    Uber Star Soi wanderer Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน Chob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Forbes View Post
    I understand what you are saying. I agree that new born babies are too young to be passed off, but once children can start walking around it does them a world of good when they are placed in a well operated day care. At one time I thought all babies should be raised by their parents, but I no longer believe that is in their best interests. Well run day cares are far more instructional than a bored mother sitting at home watching TV or playing on Facebook all day.
    Nothing I disagree with there.
    My job was highly paid ( at 50 hours a week but ) and when we bought the building for our business , we already were paying off our house and had a 3 year old , so my wife went back to nursing for the 3 nights ( so night shift mainly weekends - "penalty rate" earning obviously ) a week needed to meet its payments.
    I was very fortunate that my business took off very quickly , so that my mrs could work less and less ... but I held that job for two years more , so that we sh!tted it in for money.... and took care of our baby ourselves.

    Within a year the biz had proved itself enough so the wife could and did wind down her shifts to 2 , then one by the end of second year. So we had recorded every penny , and as soon as the payments were met regularly by the biz , she was done.... well done at least with working nights , and then she was overseeiing just the business , and just the day shift , but she could do that with a baby on her hip...
    Then I wound down my paid job to to P/T as biz grew , then I quit.
    The hours had been horrendous for those first 2 years , and 60-70 hours a week for the next 5 ( because biz was going well...555 ) became second nature ...



    But you get through this stuff.
    Point is , and this is only for ME ( well the wife and I ) , our child was with ( one of ) us 24/7.
    We bought the house next door to the business and put an office in it for the next 3 kids so as to have them with us to.
    Then there was always one of us to answer the door.
    We could work , and have the kids with us.

    But I digress.
    Baby sitting IS good for kids ( I was a teacher before , and learnt/could see that ) , but only once they , and you , are ready . Its really good to see your own baby grow in its formative years , of course.
    Its more rewarding for you than it will ever be for them actually...555

    As for Cippy.
    I have some suggestions.
    One is that maybe next time hes home , he puts into action some of the "Teaching Early Childhood Programs" he could have a look at and available on the internet while hes away.
    Stuff he can study and set up when hes back home.
    There must be heaps of modules available that he can task his wife with employing while hes away.
    I cant look now , nor do I know the levels his family are at , but what hes basically doing is setting up fun/educational work and goals program that fill in at least an hour or so a day... if shes keen , even 2 to 3 hours.
    One of those hours may be even to walk ( yes , I know , I know ...555) to the park and engage baby in gross motor stuff ... swings , see-saw etc
    Another hour could be spent on fine motor things , drawing circles and squares and pictures for Pappa , painting colours , filling water containers and pouring them into other containers , and laughing when it all goes to a mess.
    It all may seem like a load of crap , but believe me , an Early Childhood Teacher makes not only 6 hours a day out of these activities , she/he makes a career !

    And what about Thai language?
    Talking with a baby - good enough. Making a big "Gaw Gai" and the letter "A" and pointing to it and drawing them , every day , even better. A new letter each week..

    This is where , in my observations , a perfectly lovely Thai wife often falls down.
    She rightly ( in her own environment back in the baan ) expects and 'environmental education' to teach her kids most things.
    And for most of the time it works .
    Kids learn about a pecking order both from the older kids and the animals in the villiage.
    They learn gross motor skills from being told to fetch this and pick that , they learn that this behaviour gets you a nod , and that gets you a cuff at worse , and at best ignored.

    So the way I see it , often the Thai ex-farm girl is at a bit of a loss as to what to do when her situation changes to one of a more western model.

    And , AND this is just a thought , she may see the goal of 'sabai sabai' , ie .. just sitting on ones ar$e and having things pretty good , as 'achieved' and now thats done and dusted ... seek to get that happening for the krob krua ( family - or at least Mumma and maybe Dad )
    Just my thoughts , and nothing negative ....

    Now my Thai lady , who is a busy bee always ( and 42 ) , and BTW doesnt know what to do with herself OFTEN , in Thailand ...its not as if they have been trained to enjoy reading books after all ) was a bit at a loss for words when the school , which is very 'interactive' , sent Alice home with homework that said , "Draw a picture of you helping your parent/caregiver doing work around your house each week ".

    They both came to me looking a bit puzzled.
    "What can we write Khun Dee , Alice she not have to do anything now she live Phuket , ahhh , expect [sic] she to do her study..."
    And Alice is standing next to her looking downcast ...555

    And I have to remind her and say , "Bee . Remember when she liked to fill the water bottles ( 20 litres down to 300mls with the funnel ) and you stopped her? And what about the take the garbage out thing ?"
    Her reply , "Oyy she make water on the floor , messy too mutt ! ( On the downstairs floor where it will dry in 30 minutes)... an she make messy ( sometimes drop a bit somehow) the gabage to !"

    So , believe it or not , the Thai ladies who have moved from the farm and live here dont know how to keep themselves occupied... Ive now had to set 'jobs' for Alice to do daily , so they both feel good about filling in the school report.... good lord ... 555

    Anyway , no matter how many times Ive tried over the years to not be the Paw Yai ( Big Daddy - boss ) , I think I should share with Cippy my hunch that he IS, in their eyes , just that , and he has to be a tad less lassez-faire Californian and offer a bit more 'direction' to his lovely wife.
    For now.
    Isnt there state run language schools for free for immigrants that is child friendly ?
    If driving lessons are needed to get to them neccessary , isnt that another skill for her to learn?

    But for now , create structures for their lives for right now , even though they are arbitrary , because the missus is probably needing that structure for right NOW ...
    ( God knows she'll be an American wife within 5 years and be busting Cippys balls ! 555 )
    Last edited by Chob; 30th June 2016 at 05:01.
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  8. #28
    Uber Star Soi wanderer Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน MarcTwoSix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jontymate View Post
    Good post Chob.... As with all. To navigate the blending of families is dynamic and each is different. No mater the race. It is a mixture of people. It can be from a vast difference of race, upbringing and social strata. Each is a new navigation chart to avoid sinking and to add.... for many uncharted waters.

    .
    Funny........as much as I disparaged my family for their mindset in another thread, adding my wife to a pretty closed minded family was never an issue

  9. #29
    Cadet Gold Cobba's Avatar
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    I can relate to the OP.....

    My EXTG (Kai) family lives in Surin. I only visited once for one night. They live in a small village of lower class people. There home was basically a wooden shack on dirt floors. The parents are not much older than me and i assumed they were in good health but chose not work to support themselves. Infact, would rather just lounge around and do nothing from day to day, while their daughter (Kai) would work long hours, 6 days a week in an office in BKK to support them. Kai did have a younger brother that also worked, but did not provide the amount of financial assistance the ex did. Oh, and my parents are either side of 70 and still do a bit of paying employment.

    During my time with Kai, like most of us do, was sending money to which i thought was going and being used by Kai to help her live a more comfortable life in BKK, only to later find out Kai was forwarding my money to the parents which was very disappointing when i found out..... During my time with Kai, i set up a bank account (we called it the visa account)that i was depositing regular monies into, and at around the time of separation, found out the account had been closed and the money passed over to the parents.

    Looking back, can see that there are different regions in Thailand and i am guessing depending on which area the people live, will determine how much "get up and go" they have to be career minded and successful. I have heard many conversations where Surin itself was mentioned, hearing similar stories of the people folk as mentioned above.

    Comparing this to where my current TGF is from (Surat Thani), her parents are successful people, owning businesses and farmland in the area in which they live, have a beautiful big home, financed TGF and 5 brothers and sisters into higher education and finally, still work themselves.

    Getting back to Kai, and like others have said, in no way was i prepared to work here in Australia myself (average week for me is 50-60 hours) while sending my hard earned money to people that are lazy, sit around on their back side while being spoon fed and have no interest in semi providing for themselves........

  10. #30
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    Getting back to Kai, and like others have said, in no way was i prepared to work here in Australia myself (average week for me is 50-60 hours) while sending my hard earned money to people that are lazy, sit around on their back side while being spoon fed and have no interest in semi providing for themselves...
    And that, in a nut shell, is what pisses off so many western men. Those of us who have been to these small Thai communities have seen a lot of that. Of course, we have also seen the industrious ones. I can think of at least a dozen personal examples.

    But, it doesn't only happen in Thailand. I have seen LOTS of western men and women piss away good opportunities just because they are lazy.

  11. #31
    Uber Star Soi wanderer Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน Chob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cobba View Post
    I can relate to the OP.....

    My EXTG (Kai) family lives in Surin. I only visited once for one night. They live in a small village of lower class people. There home was basically a wooden shack on dirt floors. The parents are not much older than me and i assumed they were in good health but chose not work to support themselves. Infact, would rather just lounge around and do nothing from day to day, while their daughter (Kai) would work long hours, 6 days a week in an office in BKK to support them. Kai did have a younger brother that also worked, but did not provide the amount of financial assistance the ex did. Oh, and my parents are either side of 70 and still do a bit of paying employment.

    During my time with Kai, like most of us do, was sending money to which i thought was going and being used by Kai to help her live a more comfortable life in BKK, only to later find out Kai was forwarding my money to the parents which was very disappointing when i found out..... During my time with Kai, i set up a bank account (we called it the visa account)that i was depositing regular monies into, and at around the time of separation, found out the account had been closed and the money passed over to the parents.

    Looking back, can see that there are different regions in Thailand and i am guessing depending on which area the people live, will determine how much "get up and go" they have to be career minded and successful. I have heard many conversations where Surin itself was mentioned, hearing similar stories of the people folk as mentioned above.

    Comparing this to where my current TGF is from (Surat Thani), her parents are successful people, owning businesses and farmland in the area in which they live, have a beautiful big home, financed TGF and 5 brothers and sisters into higher education and finally, still work themselves.

    Getting back to Kai, and like others have said, in no way was i prepared to work here in Australia myself (average week for me is 50-60 hours) while sending my hard earned money to people that are lazy, sit around on their back side while being spoon fed and have no interest in semi providing for themselves........
    I hear what you are saying - but for many a Thai , your reasoning is invalid.

    You gave money to Kai and Im sure she appreciated that as Jai Dee , and then she followed your example and was Jai Dee to her parents .
    She had little chance of doing otherwise - her parents brought her up to take care of them and give and give and give to them.
    And besides , if she came from a dirt floored shack , the 'more comfortable life' you wanted her to have in Bkk would seem like overdoing it to someone who had learned to cope quite happily with struggling along.

    Two more things.. from my previous tgfs , even the current , 'directing' how a gift is spent or used is pretty uncool to a Buddhist.
    Their logic is , "You give this to me or not? Is it for me , or do you give for your own self gratification?"
    Buddhism is essentially supposed to be about selflessness - yet I see a lot of expats who go on and on about what they give ( Kee Mo- brag ) , and what "She" is supposed to do with all they give.

    Watch the tg while he waffles ... the smile goes , and sometimes a dark look appears.

    Its entirely their business of course , the guy has been told , "Up to you " for so long he probably believes it ...555.

    The other thing is that theres virtually no welfare.
    Its easy to be 'hard' on lazy parents/family when the dole or welfare will kick in as is the case in our countries ... not so easy when your closest are constantly inches from misery ( their own fault or not )...
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  12. #32
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    not so easy when your closest are constantly inches from misery ( their own fault or not )...
    And that in a nutshell is the crux of the matter. When you honestly care for someone, then a decent person wants to help. But, how far should that help go? It is a very delicate balance. All the stories on this thread have merit.

    Life isn't fair, and there is more than enough money for everyone on this planet to have a good life if the wealth was more evenly distributed. But, the super wealthy are not going to ever share. That is how they got super wealthy in the first place. That leaves the bulk of the benevolence to the rest of us.
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  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chob View Post
    I hear what you are saying - but for many a Thai , your reasoning is invalid.

    You gave money to Kai and Im sure she appreciated that as Jai Dee , and then she followed your example and was Jai Dee to her parents .
    She had little chance of doing otherwise - her parents brought her up to take care of them and give and give and give to them.
    And besides , if she came from a dirt floored shack , the 'more comfortable life' you wanted her to have in Bkk would seem like overdoing it to someone who had learned to cope quite happily with struggling along.

    Two more things.. from my previous tgfs , even the current , 'directing' how a gift is spent or used is pretty uncool to a Buddhist.
    Their logic is , "You give this to me or not? Is it for me , or do you give for your own self gratification?"
    Buddhism is essentially supposed to be about selflessness - yet I see a lot of expats who go on and on about what they give ( Kee Mo- brag ) , and what "She" is supposed to do with all they give.

    Watch the tg while he waffles ... the smile goes , and sometimes a dark look appears.

    Its entirely their business of course , the guy has been told , "Up to you " for so long he probably believes it ...555.

    The other thing is that theres virtually no welfare.
    Its easy to be 'hard' on lazy parents/family when the dole or welfare will kick in as is the case in our countries ... not so easy when your closest are constantly inches from misery ( their own fault or not )...
    I don't agree with this one bit

    I think it's an excuse farangs use to mask exactly what Cobbs called it, lazy

    If it were a "Thai" thing then they would all do it but outside the poor areas none do

    It's simply not more than what it is in the West
    Low class laziness

    It's not anything to be romantacized
    It is what it is....poor people being lazy

    It's funny because you would disparage any Aussie family that did similar but excuse Thai families that do the same
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  14. #34
    Cadet Gold Cobba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcTwoSix View Post
    I don't agree with this one bit

    I think it's an excuse farangs use to mask exactly what Cobbs called it, lazy

    If it were a "Thai" thing then they would all do it but outside the poor areas none do

    It's simply not more than what it is in the West
    Low class laziness

    It's not anything to be romantacized
    It is what it is....poor people being lazy

    It's funny because you would disparage any Aussie family that did similar but excuse Thai families that do the same
    Well said Marc.

    About the wooden shack with dirt floor, these people are in a cycle that never improves due to their stupidity. Scenario 1... Parents get of their ass (BTW, both are aged low 50's) and start some kind of paid employment and along with the money they receive from the children, take a step forward to improve their living standards. Scenario 2... Do nothing, continue to be lazy, continue to leach off the children and continue to live on a "day to day" basis. They have and continue to dig a hole that they and their children when they get to their age will never climb out of. A perfect example of this is of what they have and where they live after generations of their family before them. Back to Kai, she works hard, has no savings for her future and everything she earns goes to support herself (rent, living expense) and her parents. She will never move forward and is caught in this viscous circle. Unfortunately for Kai, at this stage, has no children of her own so when she ages (unless ofcourse she has children of her own in the meantime), will not have "hand out" income from her children, like her parents heavily rely on. She often expressed to me how much she loved her parents and i can understand this, but, i often question the return love from the parents....... I mean, surely the parents are not interested in her future, and how she might struggle financially to support herself when she enters her senior years, either not carinng or too selfish to think other than themselves........... Again and again i will say to the parents, "you are capable of getting off your ass and get a job to help support yourselves", but they choose not to. I mean, they could do anything no matter how small the salary was..... Set up a stall at the from of their home selling local produce..... anything...... Even if their profits at the end of the week was 500B, its something to contribute and at the same time, keeps their mind and body active.

    Again getting back to Kai, it wasn't the situation about myself supporting the family that ended the relationship (BTW, i never voiced my negative opinions about support for the family), it was the fact that she DID NOT love me, but rather only loved the money i would send her. I know this to be true when i compare the feeling and affection i receive from my current girlfriend to what i received from Kai during the time i spent with her in Thailand.......................

  15. #35
    Uber Star Soi wanderer Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน Chob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcTwoSix View Post
    I don't agree with this one bit

    I think it's an excuse farangs use to mask exactly what Cobbs called it, lazy

    If it were a "Thai" thing then they would all do it but outside the poor areas none do

    It's simply not more than what it is in the West
    Low class laziness

    It's not anything to be romantacized
    It is what it is....poor people being lazy

    It's funny because you would disparage any Aussie family that did similar but excuse Thai families that do the same
    Buggered if I have any idea what you are talking about ...

    Dont know what this means -
    "If it were a "Thai" thing then they would all do it but outside the poor areas none do"
    - but I do know there is no group of anything that are "all" or "none".. theres always a wide distribution.

    I prefaced all I wrote with :
    " I hear what you are saying - but for many a Thai , your reasoning is invalid."

    Nowhere did I make excuses for laziness.
    I did endeavour to explain why I think ( only I think ) parents like Kais get away with it.

  16. #36
    Uber Star Soi wanderer Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน Chob's Avatar
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    Oh , and this ...

    "I think it's an excuse farangs use to mask exactly what Cobbs called it, lazy"

    "Excuse" for what ?
    Excuse for handing out copious amounts of money to a Thai girls family ?
    Who do we know does that ?

  17. #37
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    Again getting back to Kai, it wasn't the situation about myself supporting the family that ended the relationship (BTW, i never voiced my negative opinions about support for the family), it was the fact that she DID NOT love me, but rather only loved the money i would send her. I know this to be true when i compare the feeling and affection i receive from my current girlfriend to what i received from Kai during the time i spent with her in Thailand...
    That is down to the crux of the matter. A man DOES know (or at least he should) when someone truly cares for him. I've been in a few of those relationships and know the difference... just as I can tell when a woman is faking her love making, or orgasm.

    I knew the very moment my second wife stopped loving me. We were in bed together and it was like an invisible wall came between us, and we were only inches apart in bed.

    My present gf in Chiang Mai is a nice lady, and I think she "sort of" cares for me, but it is nowhere close to the relationship that I had with Pui, who is now dead.

    I also know that my present girl friend's daughter likes me, but she doesn't love me like Fong who I've known since she was a baby. Although Fong is not my biological daughter, we are very close and she calls me father. I suspect that is similar to Dean (Chob) and his little girl "Aleece".

  18. #38
    Uber Star Soi wanderer Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน MarcTwoSix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chob View Post
    Buggered if I have any idea what you are talking about ...

    Dont know what this means -
    "If it were a "Thai" thing then they would all do it but outside the poor areas none do"
    - but I do know there is no group of anything that are "all" or "none".. theres always a wide distribution.

    I prefaced all I wrote with :
    " I hear what you are saying - but for many a Thai , your reasoning is invalid."

    Nowhere did I make excuses for laziness.
    I did endeavour to explain why I think ( only I think ) parents like Kais get away with it.
    Actually I re-read and apologize a bit because I do think you got a lot of their thinking correct
    So my comments were directed at the situation and not your take on it, which is always well thought out.

    But I just think a lot of their system with these poor Thai families is a crock of shit
    To put it bluntly.
    Their children can certainly look after them but not be manipulated and used like a lot of them are

    I think many of them have long looked past the romantic idea of their children looking after them and see the kids as piggy banks and don't care the pressure they put on them

    Although I am not in a situation where the money I give isn't used correctly because a huge bulk of it goes to my stepson's expenses
    I have zero problem speaking up because it is my money.....it's not a gift

  19. #39
    Uber Star Soi wanderer Thai Dreamer ผู้เพ้อฝัน Chob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcTwoSix View Post
    Actually I re-read and apologize a bit because I do think you got a lot of their thinking correct
    So my comments were directed at the situation and not your take on it, which is always well thought out.

    But I just think a lot of their system with these poor Thai families is a crock of shit
    To put it bluntly.
    Their children can certainly look after them but not be manipulated and used like a lot of them are

    I think many of them have long looked past the romantic idea of their children looking after them and see the kids as piggy banks and don't care the pressure they put on them

    Although I am not in a situation where the money I give isn't used correctly because a huge bulk of it goes to my stepson's expenses
    I have zero problem speaking up because it is my money.....it's not a gift
    Nothing I disagree with here..
    Nor with what Cobba has to say , which is pretty much a narration of a tale most of us has experienced..

    I think you are absolutely correct in that the old 'romantic notions' of loving children willingly providing for the elderly has become a nagging and demanding compulsory duty for many.
    One of my ex'es gave and gave , but her Mum was a gambler , and Mum just lost the money within hours.
    This wasnt the only issue between me and that tg - but Mums indifference to what she put her family through certainly didnt help.
    Theres not a lot of relationships that can go well when you hate her Mum to start with..

  20. #40
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    There's not a lot of relationships that can go well when you hate her Mum to start with..
    Or, in the case of my second wife's son who turned into an adult druggie that I was expected to "happily" take care of. That effectively ended our marriage.

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