Sin Soht

[phaisan]

Answering the personal questions.
We were never going to have a village wedding or a big western wedding
Well I was never going to and that was made clear years before in our relationship
Sin soht was never discussed

Every decision I make I ALWAYS discuss with my wife and give her my rationale. I am definitely type A and you won't get me to cave to outside pressure, my wife knows that
But there is never a time I make a decision regarding our relationship that I don't discuss it and give her my reasoning

I think I have an incredible relationship with my wife's family and having known me for 6 years before getting married my wife wss pretty comfortable in our path.

And maybe that is the issue here a lot also.
Many guys jump into kids and marriage with a TG way too soon without them really knowing each other
So maybe without knowing each other the way I think an engaged couple should.....the TG doesn't feel secure on how he will provide

All interesting, well and good etc, but you don't answer about how your wife or her family felt (at the time) when you refused to pay it or how you would feel if your wife shamed you in an equivalent way in front of your extended family and childhood neighbors/friends.

Also I believe your wife and MIL don't live near family or the area they are from, so maybe it wasn't a big factor for her due to this.

 

[phaisan]

Hey, my girlfriend is imo batshit crazy. She's currently walking around my property looking for the perfect 'sunlight'! 55

She's has a doctorate in psychology and is well paid to analyze other people's problems, but dang, she's nuts as hell and funny as feck

To me.

They say most people who study psychology do so because they are "batshit" crazy and want to work out why they are.

Anyway psychology is pretty much just a popular pseudoscience at the moment.

 

[phaisan]

My Thai is poor at best and yes I do watch some youtube stuff. I have a mate who has retired to Rayong, we jump on Line video almost every second day. His Thai is very good and he has been coaching me.

I try to put what I say in a non critical way so there's no confrontation to it but you guys know what sheilas are like sometimes. You can be careful as you can. It's like dealing with unexploded ordinance, it can go off without warning 555

I'm very aware of how things will look in the village. It's bad enough for her as it is, a baby and not married. There is gossip about us.

I am very aware, with my ethnic background, of doing things the accepted way. It may not seem right to some, but it is the local culture and therefore should be respected.

Learning any language is hard if you don't use it everyday, also only speaking to the one person is limiting as you get comfortable and don't expand your vocabulary unless you really put in a lot of effort it.

Once she is in NZ, her English will improve significantly.

I am glad your aware of how things look in a village, as I said before just be aware of the pressure that puts on her, what you end up doing with Sin Soht is your business.

 

[Zablive]

Not ignoring the fact at all, but as you said support beforehand, doesn't play a part in Sin Soht, so using it as a reason for not paying Sin Soht to a Thai would be pretty pointless.

Same same with a Thai.

If anything by providing those things beforehand, you are raising the expectation for a larger Sin Soht (saving face), so maybe not a smart thing to do before the wedding.

I don't disagree with you, but the reality is that is what will happen.

Acquisitive Thais of any gender should have to face up to the " Either this or that " question if the farang wants to keep his self respect ("Face"?).
This sin soht/face situation hardly exists if not in her village.

As for "culture" - my culture says the bride's parents pay for all the wedding costs.

 

[phaisan]

As for "culture" - my culture says the bride's parents pay for all the wedding costs.

In your culture, 9.9% of weddings are paid for by either one set of parents.

47.6% of couples are sharing the wedding costs with their parents, while 42.5% of couples were paying for the wedding by themselves.

But don't let silly little things like facts get in the way of what you believe now will you.

 

[Zablive]

In your culture, 9.9% of weddings are paid for by either one set of parents.

47.6% of couples are sharing the wedding costs with their parents, while 42.5% of couples were paying for the wedding by themselves.

But don't let silly little things like facts get in the way of what you believe now will you.

Fish are biting well today.

Anyone who has lived here fulltime for a few years doesn't fall for the sin soht stuff.
But good luck if it makes you feel better 555!
UP2U!

 

[Minder]

but many times in the sin soht discussions it is the family rather than the girl herself asking for stupid amounts of money...in many cases the girl is put under tremendous pressure by both sides...not an enviable position to be in

Pressure all around alright....

A few years ago (Jezzus...10 years ago?? ner,vy) .............. Mrs M and I were in BKK for the wedding of her best friend, Bloom - the very cute girl Mrs M had brought along as chaperone on our first few dates - and her Englishman bow.

So we are all staying in the King's Park Ave Hotel near Seacon Square Official Website : King Park Avenue Hotel - Special Rate 1,499? that will be hosting the big event the following evening when the groom-to-be summons Mrs M and I upstairs to assist urgently and we soon find ourselves in the middle of a crisis situation between the bride's father and the groom.

In summary the promised sin-soht had not turned up due to some international banking glitch and father of the bride was threatening to pull the plug on the whole affair if he didn't see some cash beforehand. Now whilst I had heard a few negative opinions about Dad it soon struck me listening to him and reading body language that this was not about him pocketing some cash for "selling off" his beautiful daughter as it was about his fear of a massive loss of Face.

It was quickly clear to me that Dad was shit-scared of looking like a fool and that someone had been in his ear to the effect of "what? you don't have the cash yet? He won't pay up once they are married you know" etc. I actually felt sorry for him - he was out of his depth and going down for the third time.

In about ten minutes however Mrs M calmed him down, assured him that she understood farangs because she had been living with them for years now and that the money was just late and he would get what he had been promised etc (I don't know the amount ). Dad's relief as he clutched Mrs M's hand and wai-ed me was, as they say in the novels, almost pitiful to see (I realized later that Mrs M -and I - had effectively gone guarantor for the payment 555 so that explains the :respect

Anyway the point of my story is that you have to keep in mind the social pressure that the Thai parents can be under to.

Young or old nobody wants to look stupid.

 

[bacwaan]

so did you pull that spare 100K out of your wallet and begin the "fanning spread" khun Minder...555

 

[MarcTwoSix]

All interesting, well and good etc, but you don't answer about how your wife or her family felt (at the time) when you refused to pay it or how you would feel if your wife shamed you in an equivalent way in front of your extended family and childhood neighbors/friends.

Also I believe your wife and MIL don't live near family or the area they are from, so maybe it wasn't a big factor for her due to this.

I never "refused to pay it" ........sin soht literally never came up

I wouldn't have paid it due to already supporting her son at that time..........but it just was never a conversation we had
And the fact my wife was married before with a child means that she wouldn't get sin soht anyways(from what I've been told)

As for where they live, people aren't concerned on what is going on with other's like the needless gossip in the village
People are too busy working, raising their kids and getting by to have any of these BS talks about who has what

It's only in the village that this BS has ever come up, about who has what

 

[MarcTwoSix]

In your culture, 9.9% of weddings are paid for by either one set of parents.

47.6% of couples are sharing the wedding costs with their parents, while 42.5% of couples were paying for the wedding by themselves.

But don't let silly little things like facts get in the way of what you believe now will you.

And don't let only one set of facts support your position

Sin Soht, like our custom of the father paying, is diminishing amongst middle class Thais
Most of our friends in Vancouver who were married in Thailand or gone back to marry did not follow the tradition
There is many articles on the fact it's a tradition not being followed as much as in the past..........just like ours

 

[Minder]

so did you pull that spare 100K out of your wallet and begin the "fanning spread" khun Minder...555

Nah, I needed that cash for the "Buck's Night" at Cowboy and Nana .... 555

 

[bacwaan]

Nah, I needed that cash for the "Buck's Night" at Cowboy and Nana .... 555

an altogether different "fanning spread"...

 

[phaisan]

I never "refused to pay it" ........sin soht literally never came up

I wouldn't have paid it due to already supporting her son at that time..........but it just was never a conversation we had
And the fact my wife was married before with a child means that she wouldn't get sin soht anyways(from what I've been told)

If she was married before then I agree it shouldn't be paid. Out of interest was it paid for the first wedding?

As for where they live, people aren't concerned on what is going on with other's like the needless gossip in the village
People are too busy working, raising their kids and getting by to have any of these BS talks about who has what

It's only in the village that this BS has ever come up, about who has what

But we have been talking about cuzzy whose girlfriend lives (I Believe)in her families village, so completely relevant to what I have been saying.

 

[phaisan]

And don't let only one set of facts support your position

Sin Soht, like our custom of the father paying, is diminishing amongst middle class Thais
Most of our friends in Vancouver who were married in Thailand or gone back to marry did not follow the tradition
There is many articles on the fact it's a tradition not being followed as much as in the past..........just like ours

I don't see it diminishing with Issan Thai's. It still features heavily with Thai celebrities if you see Thai news.

 

[Hatari]

^ of course it features with what passes as 'celebrity', anything to get their pictures in the entertainment pages, a lot of 'show' involved

Take your word it's big in Isaan, a reflection of the dire poverty perhaps, desperately grasping for every baht they can?

 

[phaisan]

I never "refused to pay it" ........sin soht literally never came up

I wouldn't have paid it due to already supporting her son at that time..........but it just was never a conversation we had
And the fact my wife was married before with a child means that she wouldn't get sin soht anyways(from what I've been told)

I suppose the fact your supporting her son has made it an unusual circumstance, as it something a Thai male would never do, so in a way you're an outlier to Thai culture and normalcy.

 

[MarcTwoSix]

I suppose the fact your supporting her son has made it an unusual circumstance, as it something a Thai male would never do, so in a way you're an outlier to Thai culture and normalcy.

Absolutely.....
But I find a lot of times a farangs culture isn't taken into consideration when marrying a Thai.......triply so when the Thai is from a poor family.


I never said I was against sin soht......I would have paid if it was appropriate
Although I'd never be in a situation where I felt I was being "bullied" into it

 

[Zablive]

I suppose the fact your supporting her son has made it an unusual circumstance, as it something a Thai male would never do, so in a way you're an outlier to Thai culture and normalcy.

Over 10 years here every Farang I know has financially supported their wife/partner's children from before they met.
Sometimes Their grandchildren - ref. Chob.
So in my Thai experience it's not unusual.

As many young Thai men fck then fck-off, then security and support is one major attraction of a Farang partner, if the TGF can trust them.

 

[MarcTwoSix]

Over 10 years here every Farang I know has financially supported their wife/partner's children from before they met.
Sometimes Their grandchildren - ref. Chob.
So in my Thai experience it's not unusual.

You are talking about a demographic that is sort of outside the Thai cultural norms
Hardly what you'd look at as a normal relationship in Thailand in terms of culture......well in terms of anything, really


Phaisan was talking about in normal Thai culture.
And it's true.......have you ever seen a Thai man take in his ex's kids?
I'm sure there is some out there......I've just never encountered it

 

[Nomad]

And it's true.......have you ever seen a Thai man take in his ex's kids?
I'm sure there is some out there......I've just never encountered it

Definitely, including a BM's TG's ex. Totally agree that most don't, but it happens, including in CJ's family also.